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Tpoppa

Question for Trump Haters

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I'm hoping this doesn't turn into a poo throwing contest...

I've seen a lot of articles lately referring to trump as a racist.  Full disclosure...I wasn't a big fan of Trump before the election, and I'm still not (I did prefer him over Hillary, though), but I've never thought of him or his businesses as racist.  I pretty much agree with the quote by his son saying that the only color he (Trump) sees is green & and think dollars/economics are the driving factor behind much of his policies.

My question is this:  Do you think Trump is racist?  If yes, what do you think is the most obvious example of him being racist?  

 

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I'm not trying to point fingers at Democrats or people that dislike Trump.  I genuinely want to know the substance behind the comments that refer to him as racist. 

Edited by Tpoppa

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Flavor of the week....

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I was told recently if you don't like how a particular class of people lived, that is what makes you racist. So if you don't like bottom feeders that live off the system and want to try to keep the leaches off you legs when your swimming for your life. That is what makes you racist. And keeping people out of our country that don't bring anything to the table or kicking them out because they have over stayed their welcome. Makes you a racist. I was told it has nothing to do with skin color and more to do with class of folks. Because I was called a racist and retorted with "no I'm not I have many friends and coleages of color and or different race" and I was told that had nothing to do with it. The fact that i think someone is a lowlife because they are too lazy to work hard and raise themselves up to a better life reguardless of the cards they were delt in the beginning. I was told that makes me racist. 

So by that definition, I guess he is in their eyes and I guess I would be too.

 But if you want to use the true definition of racism...

Racism is the belief in the superiority of one race over another, which often results in discrimination and prejudice towards people based on their race or ethnicity.

Hell No. It's just a card in this sick game they want to play called politics. 

 

Edited by 2talltim
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I think he's probably about as racist as any rich New Yorker. Or New Yorker in general.

 

In my experience, people from large cities like NYC tend to see things a little differently than those from smaller cities/rural areas. There's a lot more interaction with different groups of people and a lot more observation as well. This colors their view (forgive the pun) on culture and what they see as good or bad. It differs from city to city too, say in one city the majority of the crime-ridden area is occupied by Chinese, you would avoid that area and you wouldn't necessarily want to associate with people from there. In another city, the majority of the crime-ridden area is Russian, or South American, or whatever, again, you would avoid those people/that area. 

 

I think what makes Trump see a group of people as good or bad depends on whether or not he can make money off of them. As soon as the money runs out or they are no longer useful, they no longer matter and could be dead for all he cares. 

 

It's a little different from good ol' fashioned southern racism which is mainly just aimed at black people because (insert bullshit reason here), but It's still shitty. 

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I think the problem here is that many people who are "classist" get mixed in with racists. Because many many people who are racists are also classists. Also many people of color are trapped in a vicious cycle of poverty. So, it can certainly seem like if you hate poor people you are racist, because most poor people are black.

I think the closest he has come to true racism is calling some countries shitholes. Those places are almost all people of other colors.

I'm pretty sure Trump is classist, and 100% positive he is an asshole, but as for racist? Only in that tangential way I mentioned above.

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26 minutes ago, 2talltim said:

I was told recently if you don't like how a particular class of people lived, that is what makes you racist. So if you don't like bottom feeders that live off the system and want to try to keep the leaches off you legs when your swimming for your life. That is what makes you racist. And keeping people out of our country that don't bring anything to the table or kicking them out because they have over stayed their welcome. Makes you a racist. I was told it has nothing to do with skin color and more to do with class of folks. Because I was called a racist and retorted with "no I'm not I have many friends and coleages of color and or different race" and I was told that had nothing to do with it. The fact that i think someone is a lowlife because they are too lazy to work hard and raise themselves up to a better life reguardless of the cards they were delt in the beginning. I was told that makes me racist. 

So by that definition, I guess he is in their eyes and I guess I would be too.

 But if you want to use the true definition of racism...

Racism is the belief in the superiority of one race over another, which often results in discrimination and prejudice towards people based on their race or ethnicity.

Hell No. It's just a card in this sick game they want to play called politics. 

 

I'll stick with the intended  definition of racism which is based on race.  While poor, lazy, or immigrants (legal or illegal) have rights they are not considered a protected class.

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3 minutes ago, nebbish said:

I think the problem here is that many people who are "classist" get mixed in with racists. Because many many people who are racists are also classists. Also many people of color are trapped in a vicious cycle of poverty. So, it can certainly seem like if you hate poor people you are racist, because most poor people are black.

I think the closest he has come to true racism is calling some countries shitholes. Those places are almost all people of other colors.

I'm pretty sure Trump is classist, and 100% positive he is an asshole, but as for racist? Only in that tangential way I mentioned above.

I've referred to places like Philadelphia, Detroit, and Gary, Indiana as shit holes because I think they are.  Nothing to do with race.

 

   

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12 minutes ago, what said:

I think what makes Trump see a group of people as good or bad depends on whether or not he can make money off of them. As soon as the money runs out or they are no longer useful, they no longer matter and could be dead for all he cares. 

 

This is what I meant when I said I tend to agree with his son's comment that he only sees green.  Wouldn't doing business and making money on/with people of different races (and he has) be the opposite of racist?  It makes him opportunistic and greedy, but not racist.

I guess I'm looking for a policy decision that unfairly affects a particular race.  I've heard the immigration policy, travel ban, and tax codes referred to as racist, but I don't see it.

   

 

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I don't even agree with the term classist  either IF it's used on a broad definition. For me for example I don't necessarily hate lower class people. I understand there are circumstances in which people couldn't help where they're at.  But I despise the ones that cry foul and don't want to do anything about it to get themselves out of that situation or even worse the ones that put themselves in that situation.

Edited by 2talltim

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34 minutes ago, Tpoppa said:

This is what I meant when I said I tend to agree with his son's comment that he only sees green.  Wouldn't doing business and making money on/with people of different races (and he has) be the opposite of racist?  It makes him opportunistic and greedy, but not racist.

I guess I'm looking for a policy decision that unfairly affects a particular race.  I've heard the immigration policy, travel ban, and tax codes referred to as racist, but I don't see it.

   

 

Keep in mind, that sort of behavior is more along the lines of sociopathic rather than racist/classist. In fact I can almost guarantee he is a narcissistic sociopath, watching the way he conducts himself. You know, with my many degrees in doctoring and psychology. 

 

Sadly, tacit racism might be the preferable of the two when it comes to the leader of the free world. :|

Edited by what

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5 minutes ago, what said:

Keep in mind, that sort of behavior is more along the lines of sociopathic rather than racist/classist. In fact I can almost guarantee he is a narcissistic sociopath, watching the way he conducts himself. You know, with my many degrees in doctoring and psychology. 

 

Sadly, tacit racism might be the preferable of the two when it comes to the leader of the free world. :|

Narcissist perhaps.  Sociopath?..I completely disagree with that.

I thought he had a huge ego before politics.  I don't think anyone's ego has ever been reduced by being elected President of the United States of America.

I do like his take on the economy, I think he understand it as good or better than any President in my lifetime.  However, I don't think his personality or twitter account is particularly "presidential."  

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17 minutes ago, Tpoppa said:

Narcissist perhaps.  Sociopath?..I completely disagree with that.

I thought he had a huge ego before politics.  I don't think anyone's ego has ever been reduced by being elected President of the United States of America.

I do like his take on the economy, I think he understand it as good or better than any President in my lifetime.  However, I don't think his personality or twitter account is particularly "presidential."  

Sociopathy and narcissism are very very close in definition. His tendency to use people to achieve a goal and leave them holding the dynamite when everything goes wrong and his inability to take responsibility for anything in his life that does not go as he wanted it to (it's always someone else's fault) are pretty clear indicators. He also prefers to only keep people around him that he can easily manipulate or hold some sort of power over. He is also very short tempered and tends to act without thinking too deeply into subjects. 

 

But, these are just my observations. Labels don't change anything, he is who he is and we are going to have to deal with it for the next 3 years for better or worse. If he can attach his ego to making the country actually better, he may be more able to effect change than any other president in recent history, although I think that's a pipe dream. 

Edited by what

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4 minutes ago, what said:

Sociopathy and narcissism are very very close in definition. His tendency to use people to achieve a goal and leave them holding the dynamite when everything goes wrong and his inability to take responsibility for anything in his life that does not go as he wanted it to (it's always someone else's fault) are pretty clear indicators.

That describes the majority of senior managers that I have worked with in my professional career...unfortunately.

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1 minute ago, Tpoppa said:

That describes the majority of senior managers that I have worked with in my professional career...unfortunately.

It's fairly common for senior leadership/executives to be socio/psychopaths. They are generally intelligent, calculating, and don't have a pesky conscience to get in the way when they want to get shit done. 

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2 hours ago, nebbish said:

most poor people are black.

 

Hold up now.... There's as many  poor white people as all other races combined. Poverty rate may be high among black people, but it's not accurate to say most poor people are black. 

SmartSelectImage_2018-01-18-12-53-01.jpg

Edited by Steve Butters
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4 hours ago, what said:

Keep in mind, that sort of behavior is more along the lines of sociopathic rather than racist/classist. In fact I can almost guarantee he is a narcissistic sociopath, watching the way he conducts himself. You know, with my many degrees in doctoring and psychology

 

Sadly, tacit racism might be the preferable of the two when it comes to the leader of the free world. :|

No that pretty much describes progressive liberals IMHO.......you don't see conservatives or libertarians wearing pussy hats, being disgusting man hating feminists, or wanting open borders and free for all's and immunity for "all immigrants"......oh wait that is more along the lines of mentally ill or psychopaths. Nah Trump is no more narcissistic than any other successful rich individual, what sets him apart from the rest is that he has no filter. When he makes a mistake he fesses up to it, otherwise he stands by what he stands and believes, I have massive respect for that. He is doing some great things, and he doesn't blow smoke up the ass of anyone. He expects people to do their damn job, or they should be fired/impeached........period. It's about time we don't have a robot PC bought and paid for President, the founding fathers are no doubt very proud right now. Offend away Mr. President.......ACTIONS and RESULTS speak louder than words.

Edited by Pokey
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12 minutes ago, Pokey said:

No that pretty much describes progressive liberals IMHO.......you don't see conservatives or libertarians wearing pussy hats, being disgusting man hating feminists, or wanting open borders and free for all's and immunity for "all immigrants"......oh wait that is more along the lines of mentally ill or psychopaths. Nah Trump is no more narcissistic than any other successful rich individual, what sets him apart from the rest is that he has no filter. When he makes a mistake he fesses up to it, otherwise he stands by what he stands and believes, I have massive respect for that. He is doing some great things, and he doesn't blow smoke up the ass of anyone. He expects people to do their damn job, or they should be fired/impeached........period. It's about time we don't have a robot PC bought and paid for President, the founding fathers are no doubt very proud right now. Offend away Mr. President.......ACTIONS and RESULTS speak louder than words.

Sickness doesn't stand behind partisan lines. Having no filter goes right along with narcissism since nothing one says who is a narcissist can be wrong. Yet another symptom. 

 

And don't get me wrong, I hate the hard line liberals just as much as I hate the hard line new-age conservatives. They are all a bunch of idiots that have done nothing but cripple this country and shit all over everything it's supposed to stand for. 

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Mostly I see neurotic and psychotic behavior. I read once that just living in a big city will give you an average of three neuroses. None of my friends, co-workers, or even acquaintances act this way, no matter what color or tribe they belong to. Neither racist nor accuser of racism. One is no better than the other, when distributed without factual deliberation. So basically, I don't know where they all come from. Although there's a strong suspicion that this behavior is taught in schools and universities.

On the other hand, some of the worst racism I've ever seen, was a group of kids from the Middle East, that thought they saw a Jewish kid.

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57 minutes ago, Pokey said:

Haiti is a complete shithole, as is so many other countries and even cities throughout the world, Trump just says what so many of us already say or would like to say. That isn't narcissistic or psychotic, you may not agree with it but it doesn't necessarily make it wrong. I don't have a PC bone in my body, too many people are damn pussies and triggered by almost anything. The man is President and just happens to speak his mind, KUDOS to him for being REAL. I am going to say this now.....he will be re-elected.

Yeah, not going to happen. Even most of the Republican party hate him. We need a president that can be respected and respectful. Trump is not that man.

 

(Leaving thread before I have to lose respect for more people.)

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2 hours ago, Pokey said:

Haiti is a complete shithole, as is so many other countries and even cities throughout the world, Trump just says what so many of us already say or would like to say. That isn't narcissistic or psychotic, you may not agree with it but it doesn't necessarily make it wrong. I don't have a PC bone in my body, too many people are damn pussies and triggered by almost anything. The man is President and just happens to speak his mind, KUDOS to him for being REAL. I am going to say this now.....he will be re-elected.

There's a thing called diplomacy which is a very important skill for the president to have. Our current president is sadly very lacking in that skill. Strategically it is a disadvantage to wear your thoughts on your sleeve on the word stage as well. 

 

/shrug

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