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Laying the bike down.


HeavyDuty
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Laying the bike down.
I visit other motorcycle forums and I see a lot of threads that start with I had to lay the bike down. I am wondering what the riders of this form think of that statement? To me laying the bike down is something like. You are at a full stop parking your bike the kickstand is not in the fully locked position as you get off the bike it rolls forward and starts to fall over you grad it and stop it from hitting the ground hard. To me anything other than that is just plain crashing and an excuse for not knowing how to properly control and stop your bike. A bike will stop faster and with more control on its wheels then sliding down the road on its side.

Any other thoughts on this?

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Don't you know that if you grab the front brake you'll go over the handlebars and die!?

So if you have to stop fast you must lock the rear and lay'er down.

If you do it hard and fast enough, your friends will have a drunken bar crawl on motorcycles in your honor!

Edited by max power
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"Had to lay'er down" means "couldn't be bothered to learn how to ride properly." There's no case, short of speeding towards the swinging rear-end of a jack-knifing semi-trailer, where I'd consider crashing to be preferable to staying up.

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Here is what brought this question up.

4 of us running 2 abreast at 50mph on a tree lined road the speed limit is 45. A car is sitting in a driveway on the right side of road. We can see it 300 yards in front of us with no other traffic in either direction there is no sign that the car wants to pull out. Just as we approach the car it pulls out making a left had turn in front of us driver sees us and just stops in the middle of the road This is where things get fun all 4 bikes lock up the front bike on right low sides left bike stays up. Bike on right impacts car at probably 30 mph Left bike impacts car at probably 2mph and stays up. Now the second 2 bikes left bike low sides Right bike stays up. The bike on the left starts sliding across the front of right bike (my bike) and barley misses us the other bikes and the car but takes the ditch hard. I stop maybe 5 feet short of everything. All this happened in less than 10 seconds. There were no serious injuries but 3 people got to take rides in squads and two bikes are totaled. Now I see the asshat that almost took my wife and I out has posted on another forum he had to lay it down.

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9 times out of 10 there is a better option. People use the phrase to shift guilt, instead of learning better riding techniques.

I would intentionally lowside if I was way hot for a corner with reduced traction and potential danger on the outside of said corner. i.e. A drop off or trees. The reduced traction meaning I can't stand the bike up for maximum braking. The reduced traction also meaning there is no way of making it through the curve.

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9 times out of 10 there is a better option. People use the phrase to shift guilt, instead of learning better riding techniques.

I would intentionally lowside if I was way hot for a corner with reduced traction and potential danger on the outside of said corner. i.e. A drop off or trees. The reduced traction meaning I can't stand the bike up for maximum braking. The reduced traction also meaning there is no way of making it through the curve.

 

Every safety video I've seen, by highly seasoned riders who have been through crashes have said the same.  You RARELY have to lay a bike down.  It's ALMOST always better to stay on the bike until the end, partly because the commitment to do so makes you use the brakes and scrub off those last few MPH to reduce injury. 

 

"Had to lay'er down" means "couldn't be bothered to learn how to ride properly." There's no case, short of speeding towards the swinging rear-end of a jack-knifing semi-trailer, where I'd consider crashing to be preferable to staying up.

 

Yep, me too.  I'm not getting off that bike except for extreme circumstances that I can barely imagine at this moment.

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HD, I love you man...you know that. Please don't ride 2 abreast. Your story is a prefect example of why, but for a split second that second bike would have taken you out.

 

For the rest of you that say these people are intentionally laying their bikes down there is a major flaw in your logic. Thankfully I am here to point it out. For you to be correct, for them to have actually intentionally laid it down the following 2 things must both be true.

 

1) They are too stupid or don't know enough to know that laying it down is 99.99999 percent of the time the wrong thing to do. Very wrong.

2) They are smart enough about motorcycles and how they work to actually intentionally lay it down.

 

As you can see, both of those can not be true. To know how to lay a bike down means you have to have enough knowledge about how bikes work to do it...having that knowledge means you can't be stupid enough to think it is a good idea.

 

People that are saying this either don't have the balls to say they f'd up or they don't understand what 'lay it down' means.

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I thought about posting this on that forum but it’s a Harley forum and the guy is from another legion post I would not want to start any shit between our two posts. I heard the guy lock up his rear brake and saw the guy go down in my mirror and as his bike slid past it was moving in my direction. I’m glad the bike went the way it did or it might have killed the couple on the ground if it hit them at 30mph. It could have been a lot worse

Edited by HeavyDuty
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Tonik,  I cant speak for everyone.  I was speaking of the TONS of people that tell you about their own wreck...they all say "they had to lay it down"  They say it in this manner to try and prove that they had some sort of control of the situation.  When in reality they were in over their skill level.  In regards to your points...


 


1) They are definitely too stupid, but they are hoping the person they are talking to is even more so.


2) They most likely used the term "lay it down" for any wreck.


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Tiger, I think we are pretty much in agreement here. I have only heard it directly once, from a noob friend of mine. He said....she cut out in front of me, I had to lay it down.  I said you mean you locked a tire braking and it went down and you crashed.  He was like....Yeah.

 

I called him on it because he was a friend, he needed to admit to himself what happened.

 

This thread is why everyone should have ABS on their bikes.

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Jim

Thanks We will have to get together on one of your Fridays off. I was going to show up at your meeting point for the ride and go with you but I got a last minute Mission for the Patriot Guard and went on that. The one good thing that came out of this is my wife will now be wearing her helmet every time we go riding from now on before this she was more worried about her hair.

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Jim

Thanks We will have to get together on one of your Fridays off. I was going to show up at your meeting point for the ride and go with you but I got a last minute Mission for the Patriot Guard and went on that. The one good thing that came out of this is my wife will now be wearing her helmet every time we go riding from now on before this she was more worried about her hair.

 

Soon man soon. My May is booked with the holiday, kitchen remodel and a vaction/speaking engagement in Puerto Rico.  Like June 9th I start getting those Friday's off, any of them are yours. On the hair thing my wife always wears her helmet but she did whine about the hair. So we went hat shopping. Fits in a saddle bag easy....just a simple girly hat kind of like this....

 

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://img.allw.mn/content/www/2010/09/7-cute-fall-hats/cabbie_7-cute-fall-hats.jpg&imgrefurl=http://imgarcade.com/1/cute-hats-for-women/&h=302&w=500&tbnid=kkAHoD4aTannUM:&zoom=1&docid=200X0l-z3aVPiM&hl=en&ei=k5JaVd2UGqrksAT-3IDQDw&tbm=isch&ved=0CDwQMygVMBU&biw=1680&bih=883

Edited by Tonik
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My simple concept for laying it down is don't do it. I figure every time we ride I have between a 0-100% chance of avoiding an acident. The more skill I have, the greater level or awareness I maintain, and using a larger safety margin the closer I get to averaging 100% avoidance. The moment I give up and "Bail" I have 0% chance of avoiding a crash. Stick with the bike and fight for it, you may just surprise yourself and pull it off. Telling the story of how you pulled off an awesome move and avoiding a crash is much better than getting your friends to sign you casts.

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Crashing to avoid a crash is stupid.  Learn how to ride.  Maintain proper space and time buffers.  Those that 'have to lay it down' are the same 'bikers' that sport Loud Pipes Save Lives bumper stickers on their truck. Don't be an ass-hat biker; be a proficient motorcyclist.

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99% of the time

 

"I laid the bike down."

 

means

 

"I panicked.  I've never attempted emergency braking or maneuvering, so I have no idea the capability of my bike, so my natural reaction was to stab the brakes as hard as I could and surf asphalt."

 

however there is always the rare case:

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99% of the time

 

"I laid the bike down."

 

means

 

"I panicked.  I've never attempted emergency braking or maneuvering, so I have no idea the capability of my bike, so my natural reaction was to stab the brakes as hard as I could and surf asphalt."

 

however there is always the rare case:

That was incredible! That dude either knew what to do or grabbed a whole lot of brake and got extremely lucky. The crazy part is the truck just keeps going. What an asshat!! Just amazing the dude walked away from that.

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I get that people panic in certain situations, over-brake, lock the wheel(s) and the bike ends up on its side - and I don't really fault them for that ...but own up to it and say so.  "I fucked up and panicked" is a lot more accurate than "I had to lay 'er down."

 

There is always going to be more stopping traction from 2 wheels gripping the pavement than from a bike sliding on its side.  Always.

 

I just posted a few weeks ago about crashing in a super-stupid situation.  I grabbed a fistful of brake while trying to swerve.  Totally my fault.  There, I said it.  Even this group isn't going to pile on and make fun of me for it.

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